Mint Season 6 episode 3 welcomes Miguel Peidrafita, the purple hair developer at Worldcoin. We discuss the future of web3 social, fan interoperability, creativity, where he’s spending his energy in the bear market, and more.
I hope you enjoy our conversation.
- 01:38 – Intro
- 07:28 – The Purpose of Purple
- 08:49 – How Miguel Expresses His Creativity in Web3
- 11:52 – The Web3 Creator Economy
- 15:09 – Skepticism around Tokenizing Music and Building a Fan Base in Web3
- 19:23 – Why Were You So Aligned With Worldcoin’s Values and What It Was Trying to Tackle?
- 23:35 – Biggest Concerns Entering Worldcoin
- 26:05 – What Are You Focusing On In The Bear Market Other Than Worldcoin?
- 27:20 – What Are Some New Undiscovered Opportunities in Web3 That Excite You Most?
- 29:35 – One Thing Only The Devs Are Excited About
- 31:02 – Name a Creator Who Has Used Web3 Tools Really Well
- 32:06 – Outro
I hope you enjoy our conversation.
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Miguel, welcome to mint. Thanks for being on, man. How are you doing?
Miguel Piedrafita: Thanks for having me. I’m doing great.
I’m excited to have you part of season six. The biggest season yet, in my opinion, I’m also super stoked to have you on. You’re pretty prolific in the space, pretty well-known developer. You’re relatively known for the purple hair that we can see on camera right now. But I don’t want to introduce you. Can you go ahead and give a quick intro of yourself? How you got your start into crypto. And we’ll start there and work our way forward.
Miguel Piedrafita: Yeah, so I’m Miguel, I work at Worldcoin, and I have purple hair. This is like the main piece people know of me. Okay. I just like the level of things. That’s usually what people know me for, just fill in all the little things that I come up with. And recently until last year on around February with the claw NFT boom. A little before that, I guess. And I’ve been in this space ever since.
So actually, what have you spent your time doing when you jumped into web three initially, like what were the first few projects you worked on.
Miguel Piedrafita: So, at the start, it was mostly just like understanding how things work and what I could build with it. So, I was building on top of like mirror, the publishing platform, printing on with our web and smart contracts. And then I got a little more into smart contracts. I joined Showtime, which was an NFT marketplace. And so, I built mostly from there. I guess its marketplace and a bunch of other really cool things. And I started also looking more into smart contract and solidity and how to be good at that optimization, all those things. And so, I ended up leaving short time to focus mostly on those things. And then a few months later, I join Worldcoin as a blockchain engineer, but I guess I ended up doing a little bit of everything there. But yeah, and then in the meantime, I did constitution Dao, which wasn’t really great to call it but still really proud. And I’ve done a couple Dosen projects in different themes.
Got it. So, when you first initially joined crypto, was it through the Ethereum ecosystem?
Miguel Piedrafita: Yeah, there was, there was a group of friends that had UNM clubhouse and had decided to have like, makes NFT together. And leftover NFT actually, another time I was playing around with 3d design, like blender and all those things. So, they brought me in mainly to help with the 3d, I don’t know if they knew I call it then. But there was like a big community of people that have ended up working at hourly rainbow. So, all of these really, really cool companies. And so, it’s served as a way to get into the ecosystem and get to like to ask some really smart people dumb questions for a while.
So, when you initially joined did you get like Eth filled off the bat? Or did you have your hesitations of the ecosystem and overall tech
Miguel Piedrafita: I will say I got pretty Eth filled mostly because of smart contracts, I have known of creator for like a big while, but I never got into it because it was just like coins going up and down speculation and that’s like, I didn’t really enjoy that. And it was the idea of like, actually, this is more of like a global database that you can like, put any kind of data in it, which actually brought me in other themes like the main platform that has those things, those new things lately, but at least started last year, a few was like the biggest one. So that’s what I went.
So, I kind of I’d argue you’re like a little bit different than the typical 20-year-old. There’s a lot of people in crypto that love, like, prompting their age or like showing off their age, which in all due respect, if I was as young as you guys are, like, I do the same thing. How have you made sense of having like, so much experience and so much drive and ambition at such like a young age at 20? Because obviously, this started way before you were 22. Right? So, like, how do you kind of like make sense of that? Like, are your family like are they a bunch of entrepreneurs or like what’s the backstory behind it?
Miguel Piedrafita No, my family are architects actually. It was just like; I was always interested in like computers. And like taxi battles and zoom happened. I tried to get into COVID, a bunch of times failed miserably, because I was like, trying to learn from university level see books at like, nine, that didn’t go great. And then I go into like HTML, and that was more mintable and went up through here. And for free, like years, it was just a hobby, like, similar to how other people play the piano, or did soccer or whatever it was, like hobby. And they ended up calling for like, multiple hours each day for years. And then there was a time where like, I went during COVID. And I wasn’t great. And I ended up dropping out mostly because of COVID. That also because I was calling in class and not really pay attention to what’s the goal there. And so that was around the time that I got into crypto. And then I started to realize like actually this, like, I think I can maybe get a q4 and have to go back to college.
So, were you studying software development in college, and you dropped out?
Miguel Piedrafita: No, I was doing philosophy, that if I was to go to college for something, which IBM really see as a choice, or more of like, a way to meet other people and have like, the whole social experience, COVID, that was the idea originally, right? I thought my idea was just like go for something that I, it’s hard to remember yourself. Like, I really had like the background to say that I if I wanted to learn something from scratch. In CS, I already knew where to start looking west philosophy. It’s like hard to learn by yourself, when you’re like, not super deep into it. So, I was like there. Again, it was mostly for the social part.
Miguel Piedrafita: And that ended up happening. So, I dropped out. But that was the idea at least.
The Purpose of Purple
I think also another cool thing about your story is, of course, the purple hair, which everybody kind of like recognizes you for. I think it’s super important to develop personal brands in web three. Because when you’re working in Dallas, or you’re working in communities, you’re working on projects, a lot of I guess like your personal brand reputation comes into the picture and you’ve developed something that’s very noticeable about your personal brand, right. So why of all colors Miguel purple, number one? And how often do you dye your hair?
Miguel Piedrafita: Yeah, I mean, I, I like purple. I was really surprised because I’m obviously the this like, I wanted to do it for a while. So why not? When I go see Nick Leeson last year. And then with like a good selection of staff, it caught on as a meme. The New York Times palace in the whole like purple. And then that became a thing. And so now everyone like knows about it. But initially, it was just like, oh, I just want to like dye my hair, a lot of people have done that it never got these big. So, it’s been really, really nice. And like people recognize me now, it is kind of cool. I usually end up dying it around like three or six months, the color sticks, but the roots grow. So, I just have to like to get that in control. Like a little bit more. If my hair is not such a mess, you cannot really see them. But I guess what capsule is how they are.
How Miguel Expresses His Creativity in Web3
You know, I think there’s, right. I was gonna say I think there’s a creator in all of us. And I think there’s different ways to express your creativity. You express it either like through the projects that you work on and side hustles, or you just feel super excited about your hair, etc. But I’m asking like this next question, because you wrote an interesting piece about a month ago, titled web three is not a space but a tool. Right? And considering you’re super expressive, you’re super creative. You found ways to express your creativity using web three primitives, NFTs tokens, Daos etc. Can you talk more about that article that you wrote? And sort of like its takeaways?
Miguel Piedrafita: Yes, so that came mostly from like, I got into crypto and it was like, well, there’s like so, so much stuff to learn this about VBM, MEV, NFT is all of these different things and seeing all these proofs, all of that and it gets like dive right into it and for almost a year I was just like, doing research is like catching up with US presidential elections is really cool because I can kind of like explain them, know all of those things. But I realized after like doing those things, got like, the thing that I really, really like to do is build, I’m super happy when I can just like get through a break. Now we can like get in shape. And that’s super cool. And that like all of the things that I have learned, weren’t necessarily getting close to that, when it was mostly just like, recognition that like, there’s people for the less kinds of things, maybe everyone can do everything, but like the people enjoy more one thing or another, like I met some of the Panem. Team last week on a retreat. And there’s people that are super passionate about research and about all of the things that they are learning and uncovering like making new products by itself. And that is really cool. But I feel like that’s not my role, or at least that’s not the thing that I enjoy most. And it is mostly a recognition that I kind of kind of learn, got lost in the meme of like all of these tokens and tokenomics and all the things.
And I still feel like there’s some value in that. But I think we maybe get like overweight those values. And there’s a lot of people especially now, with more like expert with NFTs or expert with crypto, which is not inherently useful by itself, you have to like to add something new. I remember, after I made it, actually a few months after, again, the system set like if you can replace you with stripe, it’s not growing. And I mean, I don’t want to get people with me. But I still stand by that in terms of like, these things enable really cool things, everything new things, lenses. And I mean, it’s an example of like something that is enabled by the blockchain, I think working as well. But there’s some other things that are yes, like, not that useful or something that just like wants to build good things, just like focusing too much on all of these things that are going on every day. It’s not that useful. And I feel like it was just like a piece of warning, because I got down, I went down that rabbit hole for like a year. And it took me a year to realize and get a little bit out of it. So, I just wanted to put that out for anyone else. Who has always been in the wrong seat.
The Web3 Creator Economy
So that tweet thread it went viral, I think November 2021. Just from like the looks of it. And you sort of like depicted your mental model of evaluating and finding like innovative opportunities and web three and you talked about how like the first instinct of most people is just to like, make X but in crypto now or X but with NFTs. And I like this one thing that you said, it’s like instead of thinking how do we build X and web three, think what does X look like in web three? What are we trying to achieve with X? What’s a new way to get there? So, I guess like on that train of thought like I’m curious how you envision the creator economy web three, because you’re a creator yourself, right? You create projects, you’re a developer, you’re relatively creative person. And I think a good example social, like you mentioned with lens protocol, for example. So, I guess like just using that mental model, like what is maybe social look like in web three, what is the creator economy as a whole look like in web three from your point of view?
Miguel Piedrafita: I can give you the developer answer, which is like social looks a lot more comparable. And especially really like a VF lens, where like, if someone follows you on one platform, they will already be following in doing the other one. And so, you’re kind of like, in a way, all of your followers are like compounding are exponential, because the algorithm for your insurance will cover your content everywhere, not just in one platform. For like more, you know, for creators, I honestly don’t know, I feel like this didn’t occur, like really going deep into the room and figuring out and I haven’t really had the chance to do that yet. I feel like it’s not going to look like the, there’s like this music NFTs and I think you’re interviewing could be one of these days. My feeling for that is like it feels to fabricated, it feels like people trying to push a narrative again, in my work, but my feeling of it is just like come up with something like that from scratch. Like someone that who is not poisoned by like the narrative and of the music NFT, this to actually like build something from money and meal. Instead of from I feel like NFTs could work with music, which is where I feel it’s mostly coming from again, it’s like some, we’re looking for instance royal, but like I forgot his name because if he listens to this is going down and like a bunch of other things, which I think is really cool. And those will actually have more strains. But then I see all the things but what I feel like are just like, I have experience with NFT Illustrator, like talk with some artists and like make the thing and I feel like that’s more much more artificial, similar to how there was this doge meme where like the or you know, the Lipizzaner it’s like make it into a meme coin by tokenizing it and he really be in a call. And so, I always use as an example of like something that when you try to manufacture in that, like happened naturally some of the way like those work but these I think it was, I don’t remember the name of the coin. But this one thing did a different model. This was personal. It’s like though it was not serious and this we actually try to engineer that, and it didn’t work, and I feel like in a similar way with music NFTs and a bunch of other creator economy. Using narratives, like I don’t, it might work. I really haven’t done as much research. But my view is yes, like it feels to, like, actually work.
Skepticism around Tokenizing Music and Building a Fan Base in Web3
So, let’s talk about that really quick. Okay, because I really do enjoy collecting music NFTs. I’ve worked with artists that kind of like minted their songs. And I really do believe in the narrative, whatever it ends up becoming, I think these primitives have enabled creators and music artists to kind of like find new ways of monetization and fan engagement, and that the technology enabled that right, so what’s happening right now that you think needs to change so that it doesn’t sort of stay as a meme and actually, like embeds itself as a practical tool, as a practical model for creating music and building a community of fans.
Miguel Piedrafita: I feel like what needs to happen, and I prefix all of this saying that this is mostly just like, philosophical on my part, more than actually useful. I’m not an artist, and not a musician, I really haven’t been like, Micro Focus on this space for role. So is it just like, search from what I see on Twitter, which may not reflect but I feel like the thing is just like, when I see those narratives, when I see these things, like, this album thing was also like a big one for a while. It just like, pushes me away from being an undertaker system. In general, for because it gets like, it feels like they’ve already had them around when they fabricate. And if I go and make something from scratch, which is how I usually like to make things like not looking at what everyone else is doing, and like building my own thing, that’s why I like releasing it. I don’t feel like you can do that in those systems and is not necessarily the like the things are out there might not work, they might I have no idea. There’s a lot of people throwing money at them. So maybe it’s more of an idea of like, I feel like I am probably not the only builder who feels like alienated from the space because of all of like the busy narrative. And again, I feel like this is similar with like several tokens which are really not that complex, and people made them into a huge thing. And they were doing like solving in places where it did make, well it made no sense we can even funding from the earth. And I feel like that just like prevents me from like going and making some really fun things like the NFTs. So, it’s more of like a narrative versus we live in the news like an actual opportunity thing. But I do feel like the more we listen, we can have worked on different solutions to it. We’re in the past right? So, if you like it early on, it’s a little bit.
So, what are some of the more exciting applications that you align with that haven’t necessarily fallen into the meme category.
Miguel Piedrafita: I wasn’t really excited for a while about like decentralized social. There’s like a little bit of a meme in there. But I haven’t seen that many people talking about it. They talk about Lanza talking about like maybe, that was a thing. But they haven’t talked about a certain degree. And I feel like that has a big, big potential in the idea of like, oh, you watch the developer, one to be social network, you literally only have to like to build the web. You don’t have to like worry about all of the complex stuff that goes afterwards. And also, it’s all connected by default. I feel like that’s a really powerful idea, even for like people that have nothing to do with crypto, because you really don’t need to like to know what crypto to build on these things. And then I’m also obviously really excited about civil resistance, which I work at work. And so obviously, I would say those are like the main two things I like really, really excited about see categories.
Why Were You So Aligned With Worldcoin’s Values and What It Was Trying to Tackle?
So, let’s dive into Worldcoin really quick because I think it’s a really unique project when it came out. It made headwinds, why were you so aligned with Worldcoins values and what it was trying to tackle?
Miguel Piedrafita: Yeah, so back when I was working at Showtime, we’ve had a project that we were building that would require real structural resistance. So, I was tasked with like looking at what was available in there, what we would like to be able to integrate with flow to for sign up for this. And it turns out that there’s really nothing like this which is like hard to verify if you’re not like path communities and stuff. And also, not that strict, like someone sufficiently motivated can like reuse their multiple rarity accounts, this bit of humanity, humanities is good. If you don’t care about like attaching your video of yourself to your wallet, which some people might, I personally do not, the issue is there, you have to open one until the review goes through, it’s my review, it’s slow. It’s nothing that you can use, like say, okay, step one, you put your email, step two, you verify your humanity. And step three, you use the thing, like it’s a big white gap. And so actually, the summary that I went from desperation was like, our best solution was to use KYC, which I really don’t like. But it was like the only way of doing it in a way that women get, like, alienate a big part of the value space. And then a few months after that, what we came out, and everyone was just like really, really upset about that. I remember the day that it came out, everyone literally rolling through the whistling times. And I looked into what they were building. And also, this was around Italy, as well.
So, I also got to like talk to one of the people from the team that was there and actually ended up getting a scan, getting scanned there. And he made a thread about like, why I think this is good. But I think this is like mostly why I think this is private, which was the concern that people have. And obviously people really didn’t like the thread, I made another same thing. So, afternoon, show them when I was looking for something to do, which I felt like was great. I felt like he was probably the most interesting project in this space for me. So, it seems like they’re from the big problems. Number one scalability, but there’s like a lot of really, really smart people working on that already. And there’s optimism RB true, seeing literally everyone is working out even better like and then the civil resistance, which I would say is maybe Pro Number two, or at least to me with to a look at all the things we’ve been wanting for a while, like true quadratic voting, what I found in new government, NASA mechanisms, better aircrafts, all those things. And it really doesn’t seem like there’s not many people working on that. And from the people that are working on that I can convinced that like working is the actual way to do it. So, I decided I’ll go there and help them out. And I think that it really like I already know what I wanted to go more in like the game ecosystem. I was talking with Dan Hoffman, I was talking to Big Ted, I was talking to a bunch of companies doing this thing. And, and the thing that got me into working is they contacted me, and they say like, hey, we know that you said that you want to have a decision on where you want to go for a month, do you want like, work for us that month, and then you can just like go away and never talk to us ever again. Which I thought was like a really good offer, forget, like playing around with it, right? And what actually got me those days, I felt like they are really, they were really willing to listen to whatever I said, just like I don’t know, I feel like the perspective. Like super busy pack misuse. And from the inside. This is like literally whatever idea I brought up, it was actually like carefully analyzed and thought about. And even now I’m the embodiment like the decision process and like talking with him about sort of things. And so, I feel like, it really felt like I had, I mean, I feel like the team already really understands the idea of like privacy and the effects or whatever you know, to use. But I feel like I felt like I had the, I could help them with that. And I could get like help steer into like more privacy preserving more like all of those things and help make the system better. So that I feel like that well.
Biggest Concerns Entering Worldcoin
So, being recognized, being heard and a project that was so big and so impactful. sort of motivated you to keep going. So, I’m curious, like when you joined, you had a bunch of ideas that you brought to the table you felt listened to, you felt like your contributions were valued. What were some of your biggest concerns in entering a worldcoin that then got addressed when you actually joined the organization, right, where they like more of like the consumer facing concerns like, are we actually going to scan people’s eyes? Like Doesn’t that seem a little bit dystopian? Was it more of an infrastructure like play? Like, what were the biggest things that were running through your head?
Miguel Piedrafita: I mean, we’ve been doing, like one and a half years. So, I think, and I knew that I couldn’t stand before. Now the main thing was just like, I felt like we needed to be much better at communicating with a crypto audience. Because I feel like when the big media companies are looking at this, they say okay, it’s security break. What does think crypto think of this and so I feel like that’s great. But also, we do have protocol, which I personally think it’s really cool and we want people to build on top of it. So, in those terms I feel like it was really important for the crypto community to get to know us more and maybe to like to understand what we’re doing which they seem really attached. And so, my focus of this I remember like the for first actual week that were we’re at the office in Germany was let’s can like make a content plan. Let’s make some, let’s write some threads. Let’s write some articles, let’s explain how this work. And that has learned in a way that we want to open source the or the power for the forum next, but that has like a bunch of like lenses things on top of that, so we’re working our way there. But I feel like that was the main thing is like getting that message out there. Because before that we had been in stealth, and so we couldn’t really explain what they were, we were doing. And we announced like, this is where we’re going. But we didn’t really say that that much vocal work or like 15-minute article that I think I feel like no one could read. So, I feel like that was like the main concern. And I feel like it’s, there’s still a lot of work to do. But there’s been a lot of effort in this regard. Like putting content out there, talking to people, sponsoring hackathons, having like people you need global build with it. I think in New York, we were like the second most built probably like open sea was there, first was super fluid, I think, like right before super fluid. On top of like everyone else I feel like that’s like people are starting to understand really what we are doing. I’m really, really happy
What Are You Focusing On In The Bear Market Other Than Worldcoin?
Interesting. So, outside a worldcoin, then like, where are you focusing your energy on the bear market.
Miguel Piedrafita: So, as I said, I’ve been having a lot of fun with lens, I feel like there’s a great combination thereof the developer experience is amazing. And also, there’s not a lot of stuff in ecosystem yet. So, you can have an idea like, really quickly, probably no one else has done that yet. I feel the Hacker News clone is like that, like that was a good basic example of how to make our Linux run. And I built a bunch of utilities like something to embed your lens, Prof lens posts in your website, I think to redirect to multiple foreign ends, I think to post your lens posts to Twitter, and I’m building on with a YouTube kind of double lens, which is basically like a landslide with a YouTube interface that only shows videos. But I think it’s really, really cool. Because you start having those specific links, interface for video and all those things that can then have some more things on top of them. So, I’ve been funding that ecosystem. And then I’ve also been working on like, something’s absurd, that really have nothing to do with crypto for the first time, like a year. So, I’ve been really, really excited about that as well.
What Are Some New Undiscovered Opportunities in Web3 That Excite You Most?
I guess I want to ask you a couple more questions. Before we wrap up. What are some like new yet to be discovered opportunities in web three that excite you most, maybe that extend beyond social?
Miguel Piedrafita: I feel like there are two answers to this, I’ll keep the answer from like. And I want to like do something a bit different something what they do is if you like this, like information asymmetry, and there’s people like doing the whole like thread or thing, but there’s like, I feel like there’s an opportunity for someone doesn’t really make threats. It’s like makes a tweet, and the tweet like a summary of everything or maybe just like illustration or something that like illustrates these things. I really like these slides by value like web two in general and later some web three things and key, there’s only one person there maybe I think, Jack butcher but like something they style maybe a little bit more complex to explain things in cryptography like would be really, really welcome. So, from I want to build my personal brand in crypto that would be like my guess. And then in general of like, niches and stuff, I still feel like socially it’s going to be paid. I feel like there’s still, I’m still like really, really bullish on wallets. My original thesis for like rainbow was like it was going to be kind of for web three, with like all of the different applications implemented by themselves. I’m not as excited about rainbow anymore. But there are some other wallets I’m really excited about like Syrian, which I feel like has stepped up their game recently, or the one that will do then a booklet, which people will get the system. But we’ve gotten some feedback for like actual people like this the word that I get my current grammar, which I feel like it’s a golden standard for bots, and I’m really, really excited about that. But I feel like there’s still like a lot of stuff to be in there. Also, the family team. I haven’t seen the word there. But I talked to them when they were like starting the company. And I’m really, really excited for what they will come up with because first of all, they are amazing designers like fillers. And also, it seems like they have a more focused approach to like the world is more like a collection of your work the entity more than just like a list of tokens. So, I’m really excited to see what they come up with.
One Thing Only The Devs Are Excited About
So, I want to bring some questions from Twitter. This next one may be similar to the one I just asked, but I’ll give it a shot. What is one thing that dev community is excited about that no one else is?
Miguel Piedrafita: One thing that community is excited about. I feel like you’re just like better tools. I haven’t seen there was like brain monkey that came up to connect, you know, disconnected from the family things I would say tweets. And these things just like make development really like a less fun and much, much easier and much more better for users. That was what me, which has been building for a while. And ethers and Yahoo has been around for a long time. And there’s been like a lot of really advancements in like developer experience recently, which I feel like no one else cares for, but developers, but I still feel like it’s really, really exciting to see. And the other one, I would say is, again, like there’s some progress with x again, I have to go back to lens. Like, it’s the best example of what they build it so that even people that haven’t, that’s good to never can see, like build on top of it really easily. And that was one of the things that attracted to me, even if I hadn’t really cared about all of the other stuff, I feel like it’s really, really easy to build on this. And for developers that’s like really, really cool because you can focus on like building more complex things and then just like getting acquainted with those like the major things, but it’s mostly just like developer experience.
Name a Creator Who Has Used Web3 Tools Really Well
And the last question I have for you is name a creator who has used web three tech NFTs tokens etc, really well this one also came from Twitter.
Miguel Piedrafita: Maybe an example of this would be Mike Shinoda. I’ve been following him for a while maybe kind of like Linkin Park and on this other his own and instead of going into NFTs, he also, I don’t think he was doing a few. I don’t know what he’s doing now, what he was doing in this NFTs, which has like more of like a community but he really, I feel like he really got the thing of like, actually, this music NFT going back to it. But he’s not as far as knowing like any music NFT platform, he was just like doing little songs, doing little drawings, minting NFTs, he made an album where like the art, it was funded by NFTs, feel like that’s some sort of way at least compared to the other mainstream creators that I’ve seen getting into NFT is whoever you’d like that’s either getting lunching NFT, and then never do anything about it feel like it’s a really good example of like, like homemade, the creator feels like more of like a less professional thing, less scalable, but still actually understanding
I think this is a great place to end off. Miguel, thank you so much for being on, before I let you go, where can we find you? Where can we learn more about what you’re working on?
Miguel Piedrafita: Yes, so there’s Twitter, obviously, it’s M1LPF, then my website Piedrafita.com. So, I don’t think most people realize that there isn’t there. It’s Piedrafita.com/experiments, which is an aggregation of all of these random places where say, hey, I build this or I build that goes, those are all together in the page.
Amazing. So next time, appreciate you.